Janice Knight (interviewed by Lisa Hayes on November 9, 2022)
Dublin Core
Title
Janice Knight (interviewed by Lisa Hayes on November 9, 2022)
Creator
Date
2022-11-09
Description
Janice Knight has been a part of the Library’s staff full time since 1981, after having started as a Student Assistant in 1976. She has held many different positions (including mom, nurse, grandma, friend to many) during her tenure and is currently serving as our Bookkeeper. Ms. Knight shares stories of how the Library’s facilities and technology have changed over her decades here, and some of the big changes that happened during Anne Cleveland’s tenure.
Contributor
Hayes, Lisa
Cox, Danielle
Format
MP3
Type
Audio
Language
English
Identifier
JaniceKnight_OralHistory_20221109
Oral History Item Type Metadata
Duration
42:51/58.8MB
Transcription
00:00:01 Lisa Hayes
Alright, so my name is Lisa Hayes and I'm the special collections librarian here at the Charleston Library Society and it is November the 9th, 2022 and we're in in the conference room here at the Library Society and I'm having the pleasure and the honor of speaking with Janice Knight.
00:00:20 Lisa Hayes
Who is going to share with us all of her recollections here of the Library Society.
00:00:28 Lisa Hayes
I'm so glad and honored really, that you're doing this for me and for us and for the library.
00:00:31 Janice Knight
Thank you.
00:00:34 Lisa Hayes
So I have your questionnaire here in front of me and I'll try not to make it too formal, but can you tell us where you were born when you were?
00:00:45 Janice Knight
Born here in Charleston.
00:00:48 Janice Knight
Way back when 1957.
00:00:52 Lisa Hayes
And where do you live now?
00:00:53 Janice Knight
I live in West Ashley.
00:00:56 Lisa Hayes
And how long have you lived in West Ashley?
00:00:57 Janice Knight
I've lived in the same house West Ashley for 37 years.
00:01:02 Lisa Hayes
A long time, that's a long time. And tell us about your family Janice.
00:01:07 Lisa Hayes
Where did you grow up? And tell us about your parents?
00:01:11 Janice Knight
I grew up on James Island.
00:01:14 Janice Knight
We lived in a couple of different houses and the last house is the house that I spent most of my life in in the Loughton Bluff area of James Island.
00:01:24 Janice Knight
I have two sisters.
00:01:27 Janice Knight
A brother and, who, unfortunately, is deceased.
00:01:32 Janice Knight
My parents were both born and raised here in Charleston.
00:01:37 Janice Knight
Their families go back several generations in Charleston, so we're pretty deep in the mud here.
00:01:44 Lisa Hayes
You're a binya [been here].
00:01:45 Janice Knight
Yeah, I'm binya not a comeya [come here].
00:01:47 Lisa Hayes
So and I know you have two daughters tell us about them.
00:01:52 Janice Knight
Yes, I have two daughters, Michele.
00:01:55 Janice Knight
She's married and has two children.
00:02:00 Janice Knight
And Amy.
00:02:04 Janice Knight
They just kind of do their own things.
00:02:09 Lisa Hayes
And you're married to a wonderful guy, Jimmy.
00:02:12 Lisa Hayes
Tell us about Jimmy.
00:02:13 Janice Knight
I am, I'm married to Jimmy Knight.
00:02:15 Janice Knight
He is one amazing man.
00:02:18 Janice Knight
Very loving, sensitive, always willing to help.
00:02:26 Janice Knight
Could not be luckier or happier.
00:02:29 Lisa Hayes
I agree you're both really lucky.
00:02:31 Lisa Hayes
I know that you love him and he love you just as much.
00:02:34 Lisa Hayes
He is wonderful also.
00:02:36 Lisa Hayes
And I know you were married to Michael.
00:02:39 Lisa Hayes
He's the father of your two daughters.
00:02:42 Janice Knight
Yes, Mike and I got married in 1979 and he unfortunately was killed December of 1992 on his way home from work.
00:02:53 Janice Knight
He was killed by a drunk driver which left me to raise two children ages nine and five at the time.
00:02:59 Janice Knight
And it's been a long struggle raising two kids by yourself and dealing with their feelings of drunk drivers and things like that.
00:03:11 Lisa Hayes
I can't imagine that must have been just terrible.
00:03:16 Lisa Hayes
So, well, let's talk about your...
00:03:20 Lisa Hayes
I know you went to public schools in James Island, and you graduated from Fort Johnson High School in 1975?
00:03:27 Lisa Hayes
The year I was born.
00:03:29 Janice Knight
Thank you.
00:03:33 Lisa Hayes
And so I see here that you have been associated with the Library Society since 1976.
00:03:41 Lisa Hayes
So tell us how you first came to know about the Library Society.
00:03:45 Lisa Haye
Well, first I know you've told me before your grandmother used to live downtown, so when you were growing up here in Charleston, did you know about the Library Society before your work?
00:03:53 Janice Knight
No, had never heard of the Library Society.
00:03:57 Janice Knight
When I was a senior in high school different people actually were working here that I knew through high school.
00:04:06 Janice Knight
And then my friend, Terry was able to get me a job and at that point we were both going to tech and so while we were going to school is when we started, we were considered the student assistants and so we worked mostly afternoons after we got out of school.
00:04:23 Lisa Hayes
And what did you do?
00:04:25 Janice Knight
As a student assistant, we worked the desk, checking in books, checking out books.
00:04:34 Janice Knight
There were cards that were typed.
00:04:36 Janice Knight
It was up to us to file them in the card catalog process books by tape, by gluing in the card in pocket and the date due slips. And at that time we actually shellacked books to keep bugs from eating the covers.
00:04:52 Janice Knight
So there was an area downstairs that we would go and we’d lay out newspaper and we would shellac the books.
00:05:00 Janice Knight
So, but I worked as a student assistant until...
00:05:06 Janice Knight
Well, Let’s see.
00:05:07 Janice Knight
I guess I left that time in 1978.
00:05:14 Janice Knight
And at that point I went and worked at Swygert shipyard over on Johns Island. I did payroll work over there and after about 2 1/2 years there I did leave and I came downtown and worked at Kerrison’s department store. I was only there about six months.
00:05:33 Janice Knight
And then I had the opportunity to come back to the Library Society.
00:05:37 Janice Knight
And that's what I chose to do, and it's been home ever since.
00:05:41 Lisa Hayes
And what year was that?
00:05:43 Janice Knight
I came back in 1981, February of ‘81, so I have been here full time since February of ‘81.
00:05:51 Lisa Hayes
And that's 43 years.
00:05:53 Janice Knight
43, almost 44 years.
00:05:55 Lisa Hayes
Almost 44 years.
00:05:57 Lisa Hayes
It's really incredible, probably.
00:05:59 Lisa Hayes
The longest association of anybody in the library’s history.
00:06:01 Lisa Hayes
That's my guess I don't know.
00:06:03 Janice Knight
But I think Miss Fitzsimmons was actually here 50 years, but pretty much everyone else, you know, I told someone one time they called and asked about if we had openings.
00:06:14 Janice Knight
I told him no.
00:06:14 Janice Knight
We were like the Supreme Court.
00:06:16 Janice Knight
You either died or resigned.
00:06:18 Janice Knight
That was the only way to get us out of here.
00:06:20 Janice Knight
So since I haven't done either yet I'm still here.
00:06:23 Lisa Hayes
And we are so grateful.
00:06:25 Lisa Hayes
Don't want either of those things to happen but we know things happen.
00:06:31 Lisa Hayes
So now we know how long you've been here, and tell us about your job right now. What do you do in 2022 at the Library Society?
00:06:42 Janice Knight
I handle payroll.
00:06:44 Janice Knight
I handle accounts payable.
00:06:47 Janice Knight
Uhm, accounts receivable.
00:06:49 Janice Knight
'cause I do all the deposits and stuff so I'm watching and balancing 4 different accounts for the library.
00:06:59 Janice Knight
I help with programs sometimes, if needed.
00:07:04 Janice Knight
Uhm, just.
00:07:06 Janice Knight
A whole realm of things covering a general day and every day is different.
00:07:12 Lisa Hayes
Well, and you're very modest.
00:07:14 Lisa Hayes
You're like guard dog, mom, nurse.
00:07:22 Janice Knight
I wear a few hats.
00:07:23 Lisa Hayes
You do so much here at the Library Society and I know you probably have always been like that. I can't imagine what 25 year old Janice was like. I bet you were a lot like you are now.
00:07:36 Lisa Hayes
Am I right?
00:07:36 Janice Knight
I think in many ways.
00:07:38 Janice Knight
Yeah I was.
00:07:40 Janice Knight
I had a friend years ago who said I was way older than my age, so.
00:07:46 Janice Knight
I have been more like a Mama to everybody.
00:07:49 Janice Knight
Yeah, particularly kids in the neighborhood and then younger staff members.
00:07:53 Janice Knight
I just have always had a sense of taking care of or whatever.
00:08:00 Lisa Hayes
Yeah, you really do.
00:08:02 Lisa Hayes
I mean, when the children come in for story time, you're always wanting to, I know you want to hug them.
00:08:07 Lisa Hayes
I don't know if you actually hug him, but you smile and you light up when you see those kids come in and or when staff brings their children in.
00:08:15 Janice Knight
And yeah, kids are wonderful and to be bringing them in particularly now that we have such an incredible program with our story, time for the kids.
00:08:25 Janice Knight
It's so fun because these kids are just so excited when they come in and they will stop and glance up to see if I'm there.
00:08:34 Janice Knight
And so we say hi and we wave.
00:08:37 Janice Knight
But you're right, I don't try to hug many of them, that's kind of frowned upon in this day and age, but I would if I could.
00:08:48 Lisa Hayes
So you have seen a lot of changes.
00:08:50 Lisa Hayes
I want to talk first, maybe about some of like the building changes.
00:08:53 Lisa Hayes
So when you started, you mentioned you shellacked books in the basement.
00:08:58 Lisa Hayes
Can you tell us like what was the library sort of facility like and where was that basement?
00:09:05 Janice Knight
Well at that time the main building was the only building that we really used.
00:09:12 Janice Knight
We had purchased the Barnwell Annex in the mid ‘60s, but this building was considered more for storage.
00:09:21 Janice Knight
The, so we were downstairs on the 1st floor of the library and there was a big table in the middle of that space.
00:09:30 Janice Knight
And we would like, I say, cover it with newspaper and then literally painted shellac on the books, because that would, hopefully, at that point it was working to keep the roaches and other bugs from getting in or eating on the books.
00:09:47 Lisa Hayes
Those were the circulating books?
00:09:50 Janice Knight
Yes, and you'd have to leave them for a couple of days to make sure that they were dry and not real tacky feeling, so that would happen and then we’d bring them up.
00:09:58 Janice Knight
And of course we did the shelving. As student assistants we did the shelving.
00:10:01 Janice Knight
So we would put those out.
00:10:07 Janice Knight
But that was downstairs.
00:10:08 Lisa Hayes
Downstairs and where was your desk?
00:10:11 Lisa Hayes
Where did the librarians sit?
00:10:15 Janice Knight
At that time, the librarians’ desks were in the center of the back area near the steps going up to the balcony.
00:10:27 Janice Knight
As student assistants, we really didn't have a desk because we weren't expected to be sitting down.
00:10:35 Janice Knight
So we did not need to have a desk.
00:10:39 Janice Knight
As time went on in that same space, there were six desks in that area which included the head librarian and several other librarians in that space.
00:10:56 Janice Knight
Myself, I am not a librarian.
00:10:59 Janice Knight
My background is accounting, and that's what I do.
00:11:03 Janice Knight
But we were all in that area and in that space the one lady, one librarian, would be checking books or reading journals to choose books to be purchased.
00:11:17 Janice Knight
The catalog librarian.
00:11:19 Janice Knight
She would catalogue the books.
00:11:21 Janice Knight
I would type the cards in the pockets and whatever was necessary to make the book, to prepare the book to be put into circulation.
00:11:31 Janice Knight
And so the six desks were back there.
00:11:35 Janice Knight
And at that point the student assistants did have a desk, but we had at least three student assistants most of time, and so they rotated.
00:11:44 Janice Knight
You know 'cause they weren't all here at the same time, so but they did have a desk that they rotated and used.
00:11:51 Lisa Hayes
And did you work with the patrons coming in, like, how...
00:11:57 Lisa Hayes
I guess I'm trying to get an idea of where you had a lot of staff, it sounds like.
00:12:01 Lisa Hayes
But how busy was the library and did you help people find things?
00:12:04 Lisa Hayes
Or were you, since you were doing accounting where you..?
00:12:07 Janice Knight
Yes and yes.
00:12:09 Janice Knight
We did a lot.
00:12:10 Janice Knight
I was still doing, you know, the phone would ring you get the phone, someone would come to the desk, you work the desk.
00:12:17 Janice Knight
Usually it was kind of, first one to get up.
00:12:20 Janice Knight
Well, that was usually me.
00:12:22 Janice Knight
But whatever, so I would, you know, you'd work the desk.
00:12:26 Janice Knight
You would help people locate books, you would, you know, take the books in that they had brought back.
00:12:34 Janice Knight
Make sure that they realized if they had fines that needed to be paid, or if they had one book out still that they haven't checked under the car seat for.
00:12:44 Janice Knight
Or whatever in order to get things in order.
00:12:47 Janice Knight
And then of course by the end of the day, then those books would have been shelved.
00:12:52 Janice Knight
Uh huh, they were returned.
00:12:53 Lisa Hayes
Did the special collections what we call the special collections? The archives?
00:12:58 Lisa Hayes
Did that collection get used very much in that time, like where people coming in to look at the old stuff then?
00:13:04 Janice Knight
At that time we used a lot of things in what we call the lock section and a lot of those, well, those books have been transferred into what is now special collections.
00:13:16 Janice Knight
And they were in an area that we would frequently use.
00:13:20 Janice Knight
That was why we kept them on the main floor.
00:13:24 Janice Knight
People used books at that time.
00:13:27 Janice Knight
You didn't have the computer, you didn't rely on that type of electronic source.
00:13:33 Janice Knight
It wasn't available at that time, so when they would come in, we had books in the lock section that were kind of our immediate go to and people did a lot more genealogy work at that time and they would literally sit down with the books and trace certain people in the histories or plantations and the histories and different things.
00:13:57 Janice Knight
But they did it by reading the books.
00:14:01 Janice Knight
It wasn't just plug it into a computer and wait for it to give you the answer. It took a long time to do what today doesn't take nearly that long.
00:14:10 Janice Knight
Oh sure, yeah, and you know they we would need to know like a time period or were they actually here?
00:14:17 Janice Knight
Did they really come into Charleston or did they actually come into the United States from New York?
00:14:22 Janice Knight
Well, then we wouldn't necessarily have the records that they needed.
00:14:26 Janice Knight
There were times we would also refer them possibly to the Historical Society or to the Public Library if we thought that they might have just a little bit different records than what we actually had, and the three of us, the three organizations, worked well together, because although we all had a lot of the same things, everyone had a little something that somebody else didn't.
00:14:52 Janice Knight
And so it was easy to refer people you know, OK, you didn't find anything here, but you still need to check the Historical Society or the main library and see if possibly they have other records so.
00:15:07 Lisa Hayes
Well, and so I kind of we kind of know what you did in a day.
00:15:11 Lisa Hayes
Am I right?
00:15:12 Lisa Hayes
Like is there anything else you want to add to what kinds of things you were working on at that or it doesn't have to just be early days, but is there anything else you'd like to tell us about your duties here?
00:15:26 Janice Knight
There are certain things that are done primarily day-to-day, and then there are always other things that come up and setting priorities as to how those extra things get done or when they get done is a big part of my day.
00:15:43 Lisa Hayes
Yeah, yeah.
00:15:45 Lisa Hayes
Well, so tell us who hired you.
00:15:48 Lisa Hayes
Well, we could talk a little bit about staff now that you've seen a lot of staff come and go.
00:15:54 Lisa Hayes
Who did you interview with?
00:15:55 Lisa Hayes
If you remember that.
00:15:57 Janice Knight
Well, when I first came in 1976, Virginia Rugheimer, who was the head librarian at the time, she hired me at that point. When I came back in 1981, Catherine Sadler, who was the head librarian at that time, she was the one who hired me at that point. And then, of course, I've worked with Cathy for many, many years. And then Eric Emerson for 2 1/2 years. And Anne Cleveland now for 14 years.
00:16:31 Lisa Hayes
Or some years wow.
00:16:35 Lisa Hayes
So you, you've been here since Anne has been here and I know you've seen a lot of change since Anne has been here,. Has has her tenure have been the one where you've seen the biggest changes or what can you tell us about some of the other big changes that you've seen?
00:16:54 Janice Knight
Definitely working with Anne has been the biggest changes, not just to the facility itself but how things have been done. Changing up the way the collection is handled is a big change that has happened in the time that Anne has been here.
00:17:10 Janice Knight
Not necessarily that Anne has done it, but she has brought in a fabulous team of people who have changed the way that things are processed and handled and it's making, it has made a huge difference to the Library Society.
00:17:29 Janice Knight
To the collection to the institution that we are.
00:17:38 Lisa Hayes
Yeah, I feel really lucky to be here in, during her tenure, which is about to end. But I do think I mean, what, can you tell us some about what things were like maybe in the 1980s and 90s as far as projects that the staff was working on? I know that's kind of the era when, well, we didn't get our online catalog until 2013, but what are some of the other technological changes, maybe that happened before that?
00:18:07 Janice Knight
Well, the first computer we had in here, the monitor itself was about the size of a console TV back in the ‘70s. It was huge and I am not a fan of technology.
00:18:21 Janice Knight
I still like a piece of paper and a pencil. I'm just fine. But when we first started using the computer.
00:18:29 Lisa Hayes
Where was that computer stored?
00:18:31 Janice Knight
Actually, that computer was in this room that we're sitting in right now (the Fellows Room).
00:18:39 Janice Knight
It was against the wall right over here, which would be the south wall of the conference room, and it was a big piece and I was always scared to death of it.
00:18:50 Janice Knight
So I would tell Cathy that all I knew was BRB.
00:18:56 Janice Knight
Big red button. It turns it on, turns it off.
00:18:58 Janice Knight
I don't know a thing.
00:18:59 Janice Knight
I don't know anything else about
00:19:00 Lisa Hayes
What was it used for?
00:19:02 Janice Knight
Actually she, we would keep up with the checks as we paid bills.
00:19:07 Janice Knight
We could do that on the computer.
00:19:10 Janice Knight
We also did a lot of the membership things, were finally getting put on to the computer at that point.
00:19:20 Janice Knight
But we still, but at that time we did not use the computer as part of our desk like we do now.
00:19:27 Janice Knight
At the main desk you have a circulation person there and everything is done through the computer.
00:19:36 Janice Knight
We were still very much old school and everything was done paper and pencil.
00:19:43 Janice Knight
Even right down to the markings of the date due for the when the book should be returned.
00:19:51 Janice Knight
There were so many chores and stuff that we did every day that seemed kind of silly now, but it was what ran the library at the time to know the number of fiction or nonfiction that went out or when we first started collecting DVDs, which was a huge thing at that point and, you know, learning how to or choosing a way to record them so that you could find out if we actually had that title in our collection of DVD movies.
00:20:27 Janice Knight
But the memberships which I worked on, they were all done by hand and there were like 5 different places that I had written out a person name and address.
00:20:38 Janice Knight
So by the time I finished I pretty much had it memorized.
00:20:42 Janice Knight
They were, there was a time when I knew who was in the library by the cars that were in the parking lot.
00:20:49 Janice Knight
Just one of those silly things.
00:20:50 Lisa Hayes
Well, and I've been here when someone has come in, he's been a member for maybe a long time, but you haven't seen them in a long time, but you will recognize them, know their name, and know their address and their member number I think.
00:21:01 Janice Knight
I have won many. But it's just one of those certain people make certain images, you know, or they do something that makes you remember, yeah, whether it's something quirky.
00:21:17 Janice Knight
Whether it's something very sweet, whether it's just the way they talk to you or talk with you.
00:21:24 Janice Knight
Do they talk at you or talk with you and there's a difference.
00:21:28 Janice Knight
So it just depends upon how I have perceived that person as to how easy it was to remember a name. Or not.
00:21:41 Lisa Hayes
Well, so you talk about this giant computer. Was that around, I'm afraid to ask, but was that like 1985?
00:21:48 Lisa Hayes
Or was that like 1997 when we got that computer?
00:21:51 Janice Knight
No, it would have been in the 80s. And actually it might have been early 80s at that point, it could have actually been early 80s.
00:21:59 Lisa Hayes
OK.
0:22:03 Janice Knight
But like I say it was, it was still.
00:22:06 Janice Knight
It was such a dinosaur, but it was top of the line at that time.
00:22:13 Lisa Hayes
Was it hard to get funding for things like that?
00:22:16 Lisa Hayes
Was the board at that time supportive of advances that the library wanted to make?
00:22:22 Janice Knight
Yeah, now some of it might have taken a little more arm twisting than other things, but knowing how it was going to be used and who would be used, it wasn't like we were putting it out on a table for anyone to just walk by and play with or something.
00:22:38 Janice Knight
So the fact that it was being used by staff only and it was in a room that no one else would have been going to anyway.
00:22:48 Janice Knight
It wasn't hard to get permission to get into the technological age, so.
00:22:55 Lisa Hayes
OK, so in 2013 is when we got the online catalog. Was that process pretty smooth? I mean I'm jumping ahead a lot of years, but like up until from say 1985 to 2013 when someone wanted to check a book out, would they look at the, they would look at the card file to find the card and then what what would that process be after that?
00:23:20 Janice Knight
If they were coming to the desk to check out a book, we would pull out the card from the pocket. Where if it was a buff colored card, it was a nonfiction and you knew that because it would have two sets of numbers on it before you had the authors name and the title of a book.
00:23:38 Janice Knight
That's how you knew that it was a non fiction.
00:23:41 Janice Knight
For a novel or for, excuse me or for, or a mystery.
00:23:46 Janice Knight
It was on what we call like a salmon colored card, so you knew that it was different.
00:23:53 Janice Knight
So you would pull the card out and we take the date due stamp, and we'd stamp that. We'd stamp the date due slip in the front of the book and we would tell them, OK, your book is due 2 weeks from now.
00:24:05 Janice Knight
The 12th or whatever it might have been. And then those cards we would stamp with the same date due.
00:24:13 Janice Knight
And every membership has a number.
00:24:16 Janice Knight
That number was then written on the next line, so if Barbara Doyle had come in to take out something for herself, I know that we would stamp those and the number was 346.
00:24:31 Janice Knight
That was her number.
00:24:32 Janice Knight
I could look at cards, a lot of cards, and pretty much tell you who had had the book based on the fact that I had known whose number was what.
00:24:41 Lisa Hayes
Well, and did you do that for privacy so that the person who got the book next wouldn't know who just had it, or no?
00:24:47 Janice Knight
It really wasn't that at the time, it was just the way it was done.
00:24:54 Janice Knight
At that point I don't think we were worried nearly as much as, or as cautious at that time as what we try to be now that you can't tell that you know Jane Smith had that book last.
00:25:07 Janice Knight
It doesn't refer to anything unless you happen to know that person well enough and know what their card number is.
00:25:15 Janice Knight
Otherwise it would just have someone else's number on it.
00:25:19 Janice Knight
And when the book was returned, you would look through the date due stamp. If it told you it was due on the 12th you would go to the cards because they had been put behind that date in these little trays that we used at the desk. You'd look behind that number and you would match up the card to what the pocket said in the front of the book and you put it back and then that was how it was checked in.
00:25:48 Janice Knight
Whereas now we slide it under the digital beep and it's checked back in.
00:25:54 Lisa Hayes
So did you have much problem with people stealing books or not returning books?
00:26:00 Janice Knight
I think the biggest problem we got into was college students.
00:26:06 Janice Knight
Because they would need the books for research papers or, and then they never seemed to find time to bring them back.
00:26:15 Janice Knight
Now there was a time that the college used to help us by withholding the students grades until they squared up with the library, which meant that they had to bring back our books. And I don't know if they all paid fines, but at least we got our books back, which was the most important part.
00:26:35 Janice Knight
Ah, but there were many times that we've just never gotten the books back.
00:26:41 Janice Knight
But when someone would come in and go, I have been looking everywhere for this.
00:26:46 Janice Knight
My radar went off and said, I'm sorry, you know, as a new member I can't let you check that out right now.
00:26:52 Janice Knight
Your name actually has to go before the board of trustees.
00:26:56 Janice Knight
And they don't meet again until and whatever their next date might have been, because nine chances out of ten, that book would have not come back to the house.
00:27:07 Lisa Hayes
They would have joined and just taken that book and then not brought it back 'cause they had been looking everywhere for that. Now if they hadn't said that, I would not have had my radar out to catch that, but because he did, it alerted me that I'm not sure if I trust this.
00:27:25 Janice Knight
If they've been looking that hard, then maybe this is the time to just throw out the story that the board has to approve the memberships.
00:27:36 Lisa Hayes
Before they can join.
00:27:38 Lisa Hayes
So I'm talking a little bit about theft of books.
00:27:41 Lisa Hayes
I know there's a story about our Audubon elephant folios.
00:27:46 Lisa Hayes
Do you want to share with us what you know about that?
00:27:50 Janice Knight
Well, we went looking to do the annual inventory to make sure that everything was in good shape and accounted for.
00:28:01 Janice Knight
And the storage area that they were supposed to be in was empty.
00:28:05 Janice Knight
Apparently someone had managed to get them out of the building.
00:28:10 Janice Knight
The only thing we could figure is that at the time they must have hid in the library until after we had left.
00:28:21 Janice Knight
And at that point they simply opened the back door and walked right out with them.
00:28:28 Janice Knight
Luckily, through just minor chit chat and things that we remembered, we kind of came up with an idea as to who might have taken it.
00:28:38 Janice Knight
And so, of course it was all discussed with the police and then they had to get your story and make sure that.
00:28:46 Janice Knight
Anyway, long story short, they did find them.
00:28:49 Janice Knight
They were returned.
00:28:50 Janice Knight
At that point, they were put in crates and put in a bank vault.
00:28:56 Janice Knight
But of course, the purpose of the Audubons was never just to put them in a bank vault. These were just amazing prints.
00:29:06 Janice Knight
In essence, they finally decided there was, I believe, there was an individual.
00:29:11 Janice Knight
It might not have been, but I think it was an individual who wanted to purchase the whole collection.
00:29:19 Janice Knight
And the board of Trustees, after talking it through and trying to figure out, you know, if it was worth doing, if it was the best choice for the Audubons.
00:29:34 Janice Knight
And I believe was around 1984 that they chose, yes, it was. It was a smart choice for the library financially, but also for the Audubons to be sold because this person was also going to be able to preserve and restore some of the things that might have had some issues.
00:29:57 Lisa Hayes
Uh huh, well so and we're so lucky now that we have the new building, the newest building with the two vaults in it. Can you tell us about how that purchase?
00:30:09 Lisa Hayes
I think it was in 1995.
00:30:10 Janice Knight
Actually, we purchased the property, which is the Ripley Ravenel building now.
00:30:17 Janice Knight
In early 90s and in 1995, that building was built.
00:30:23 Janice Knight
And then that includes the Executive Director's Office, librarians’ offices, workspace. At that time we also had, moved the children’s room from the main, to the upper level of the Ripley Ravenel building, but that has been changed over the years.
00:30:46 Janice Knight
The configuration of the space is totally different from the way it was built initially, but having the two vaults in the Ripley Ravenel building is an amazing protection for our rare books, manuscripts, maps, special collections.
00:31:11 Lisa Hayes
And the, and now we have Buxton books in the front part of the Ripley Ravenel downstairs. What was that space thought to be?
00:31:21 Lisa Hayes
What was the purpose of that initially?
00:31:24 Janice Knight
Initially, I think they had planned that the librarians would use that space downstairs.
00:31:32 Janice Knight
They had, it was all set up with computer access and telephone access, etc., which would have put them on the level with the main vault.
00:31:48 Janice Knight
They really decided that maybe that was not the best use and they started to use it as it was used several times for book sales. But then it was turned into some retail space and the first person that was down there was a young woman who had an art gallery and it went OK for a couple of years and then she wasn't doing it. She, her business was not doing very well, and so she had to leave. And then we had another person that went in, and he had an antique store, and he was in there for numerous years and then when he left because he was ill, he was closing down his business. And then luckily enough through Anne we now have Buxton Books downstairs, which is a wonderful collaboration.
00:32:43 Lisa Hayes
And we also, so we're in the middle building. The annex building.
00:32:48 Lisa Hayes
What can you tell us?
00:32:48 Lisa Hayes
So we have the bindery here now below us.
00:32:52 Lisa Hayes
Tell us about how the bindery came to be.
00:32:55 Janice Knight
That is another Anne project. She thought that the library needed a space like that where you could make repairs and different things.
00:33:07 Janice Knight
She was lucky enough to find Brien Biedler at first.
00:33:12 Janice Knight
And when the area was, you know, created basically because it had been used for so many years for storage.
00:33:21 Janice Knight
So when it was all cleaned up and made into the bindery that it is now, he was the first bookbinder for the Library Society.
00:33:32 Janice Knight
And it turned out to just be, you know, a perfect combination.
00:33:37 Lisa Hayes
Yeah, and the equipment that's in there.
00:33:39 Lisa Hayes
Do you remember how that came to be here at the library?
00:33:43 Janice Knight
Different things.
00:33:44 Janice Knight
Different people have donated things that they had personally, or they were closing down different areas.
00:33:52 Janice Knight
And James, who is now the bookbinder.
00:33:55 Janice Knight
James Davis.
00:33:58 Janice Knight
But different pieces have come to us through different means.
00:34:04 Lisa Hayes
Well, and I want to know during Hurricane Hugo or any other big sort of natural disasters or big events here in Charleston. Sort of what was, what were you doing and how did the library fare?
00:34:19 Lisa Hayes
So maybe we could start with Hurricane Hugo, or if there's something else that's earlier that you want to tell us about.
00:34:24 Janice Knight
Well Hugo, in 89. We were very fortunate. We had, Cathy and I, 'cause I came in with her ahead of time, and there were areas along the 1st floor of the main building that things were not on the floor, but only a few inches off the floor.
00:34:47 Janice Knight
And so we took them and put them on tables and covered them so that they, if we had gotten any water coming in, these items were not going to be threatened with the water.
00:35:00 Janice Knight
They were on a higher surface.
00:35:01 Janice Knight
So we did that through a couple of areas and we were very fortunate.
00:35:08 Janice Knight
The area above the nonfiction on the balcony end, up towards where there is an opening that goes to the roof, apparently the opening blew open.
00:35:23 Janice Knight
We lost maybe 10 or 12 books up there, which was phenomenal considering what it could have been.
00:35:30 Janice Knight
Yeah, so that was basically all the damage that we had.
00:35:37 Lisa Hayes
Did you have any damage at your house or no?
00:35:39 Janice Knight
We were fortunate.
00:35:42 Janice Knight
There were, we had plenty of pine trees in the backyard that do not exist now.
00:35:46 Janice Knight
The pecan tree was beautiful, but it no longer exists.
00:35:49 Janice Knight
I took out all the trees but by grace of God my house was not hurt.
00:35:54 Janice Knight
Needed the roof, but that was not a big deal because it, it probably would have needed it in a short time anyway.
00:36:03 Janice Knight
But we were lucky in many fashions, in many, many ways that we did not have personal loss.
00:36:12 Janice Knight
Now Cathy lived downtown and she ended up with four and a half feet of water in her home.
00:36:19 Janice Knight
So she had tremendous loss of her personal items and collections.
00:36:26 Lisa Hayes
Did she come to the library that day to stay safe or was she at her house?
00:36:30 Janice Knight
When it happened, she was not at her house when it happened, but actually she and her family that were in the back half of her house, they came and stayed at the library for several days because of the water and the conditions and what have you.
00:36:47 Janice Knight
They were able to stay here that was high and dry.
00:36:54 Janice Knight
That also allowed her to watch the collection and make sure that what I said was the only problems we had was truly the only problems that we had.
00:37:05 Janice Knight
We were lucky.
00:37:06 Lisa Hayes
Well, and I would think we didn't have a security system then and if power was out, you know, might think about people breaking in to maybe steal things, I don't know.
00:37:15 Janice Knight
Well we weren't as concerned, I think, about anyone breaking in.
00:37:20 Janice Knight
It was really more whether or not we would get water on the peninsula, but luckily for the Library Society, it's on pretty much the highest point of the peninsula that is truly the peninsula and not filled in land, which a lot of Charleston peninsula is.
00:37:40 Janice Knight
So we were not in a danger zone per se for flooding.
00:37:46 Lisa Hayes
So well, and so how many times would you guess that you've had to, I don't know, board up the windows here at the library? Or do any kind of hurricane prep over the last few years.
00:37:58 Janice Knight
Numerous numerous times that we have gone back and move things out of harm's way.
00:38:06 Janice Knight
You know, worrying about if something could come through a window or, you know, were we locked securely, you know, so there have been numerous times that we've had to get our game plan together and get things prepared.
00:38:23 Lisa Hayes
And was Hugo really the only sort of incident that even something did happen?
00:38:30 Janice Knight
Yeah, other times it was really rain, but not necessarily anything that damaged or caused any concern to the Library Society.
00:38:43 Janice Knight
So like I said, we we're pretty fortunate to be where we are downtown.
00:38:50 Lisa Hayes
Well, so do you want to talk some about some cultural things and us?
00:38:54 Lisa Hayes
Spoleto is a big thing in here in Charleston, and the Charleston literary festival.
00:39:00 Lisa Hayes
Are there other kind of big things that you can think of that has been a, I don't know, like a touchstone here at the Library Society?
00:39:10 Janice Knight
Well Spoleto used to do several of their events here.
00:39:14 Janice Knight
Martha Teichner used to come and do her “Talks with Martha Teichner” here and she's a delightful person and she actually has a membership too.
00:39:27 Janice Knight
But she would come in and she was interviewing people who were part of other events. They were here to do.
00:39:36 Janice Knight
Maybe they were with dance or music or opera or something.
00:39:43 Janice Knight
And so she was taking that time to introduce these people that made the ticket much more appealing, I think because you got to hear the person. You got to know the person in that time instead of maybe sitting and watching a play or watching or listening to an opera or something. You had actually had the chance to hear this person speak, and she did that for numerous years.
00:40:10 Janice Knight
The literary festival was, used to be Charleston to Charleston when it was first founded here, and we had, of course, a lot of the programs were done right here.
00:40:23 Janice Knight
Then we grew to the point that we had to go over to the Dock Street Theater.
00:40:30 Janice Knight
And things have changed over the years and they are a separate entity now. They are not part of us here at the Library Society. But they seem to have a lot going for them, and the festival seems to be rolling along very well.
00:40:47 Lisa Hayes
Well, and I know from working here, I know that some of your favorite programs seem to be the music programs is that right?
00:40:54 Janice Knight
I do enjoy the music programs. I love to have the CSO come in, or chamber music Charleston.
00:41:02 Janice Knight
I'm just fascinated with the talent of these folks.
00:41:07 Janice Knight
I have absolutely no talent whatsoever.
00:41:10 Janice Knight
And it just makes it that much more amazing to me that they are so talented.
00:41:21 Janice Knight
And the music is just beautiful.
00:41:23 Janice Knight
It doesn't matter if you're really into opera or classical or, I love Laura Ball and the things that she brings in. So it's everything from Beatles Bach and beer to you know, opera.
00:41:39 Janice Knight
But it's still, it's just amazing that all the talent, yeah, that these people have.
00:41:45 Lisa Hayes
What people are capable of with a lot of practice, yeah.
00:41:58 Lisa Hayes
Well, I don't know. Janice, is there anything else that I have not asked you about that you feel like people would like to know about anything at all?
00:42:09 Janice Knight
I think we've done a pretty good job of covering things.
00:42:13 Janice Knight
I still, every day is a new day in many ways.
00:42:22 Janice Knight
Not just, it's a new day.
00:42:25 Janice Knight
Coming in every day is different.
00:42:28 Janice Knight
You don't necessarily see the same people every day.
00:42:31 Janice Knight
You don't necessarily work with the same people every day, so every day is different.
00:42:38 Janice Knight
You meet someone new.
00:42:40 Janice Knight
You learn something new.
00:42:43 Janice Knight
So it's just an amazing place to be.
00:42:48 Lisa Hayes
Thank you, thank you.
Alright, so my name is Lisa Hayes and I'm the special collections librarian here at the Charleston Library Society and it is November the 9th, 2022 and we're in in the conference room here at the Library Society and I'm having the pleasure and the honor of speaking with Janice Knight.
00:00:20 Lisa Hayes
Who is going to share with us all of her recollections here of the Library Society.
00:00:28 Lisa Hayes
I'm so glad and honored really, that you're doing this for me and for us and for the library.
00:00:31 Janice Knight
Thank you.
00:00:34 Lisa Hayes
So I have your questionnaire here in front of me and I'll try not to make it too formal, but can you tell us where you were born when you were?
00:00:45 Janice Knight
Born here in Charleston.
00:00:48 Janice Knight
Way back when 1957.
00:00:52 Lisa Hayes
And where do you live now?
00:00:53 Janice Knight
I live in West Ashley.
00:00:56 Lisa Hayes
And how long have you lived in West Ashley?
00:00:57 Janice Knight
I've lived in the same house West Ashley for 37 years.
00:01:02 Lisa Hayes
A long time, that's a long time. And tell us about your family Janice.
00:01:07 Lisa Hayes
Where did you grow up? And tell us about your parents?
00:01:11 Janice Knight
I grew up on James Island.
00:01:14 Janice Knight
We lived in a couple of different houses and the last house is the house that I spent most of my life in in the Loughton Bluff area of James Island.
00:01:24 Janice Knight
I have two sisters.
00:01:27 Janice Knight
A brother and, who, unfortunately, is deceased.
00:01:32 Janice Knight
My parents were both born and raised here in Charleston.
00:01:37 Janice Knight
Their families go back several generations in Charleston, so we're pretty deep in the mud here.
00:01:44 Lisa Hayes
You're a binya [been here].
00:01:45 Janice Knight
Yeah, I'm binya not a comeya [come here].
00:01:47 Lisa Hayes
So and I know you have two daughters tell us about them.
00:01:52 Janice Knight
Yes, I have two daughters, Michele.
00:01:55 Janice Knight
She's married and has two children.
00:02:00 Janice Knight
And Amy.
00:02:04 Janice Knight
They just kind of do their own things.
00:02:09 Lisa Hayes
And you're married to a wonderful guy, Jimmy.
00:02:12 Lisa Hayes
Tell us about Jimmy.
00:02:13 Janice Knight
I am, I'm married to Jimmy Knight.
00:02:15 Janice Knight
He is one amazing man.
00:02:18 Janice Knight
Very loving, sensitive, always willing to help.
00:02:26 Janice Knight
Could not be luckier or happier.
00:02:29 Lisa Hayes
I agree you're both really lucky.
00:02:31 Lisa Hayes
I know that you love him and he love you just as much.
00:02:34 Lisa Hayes
He is wonderful also.
00:02:36 Lisa Hayes
And I know you were married to Michael.
00:02:39 Lisa Hayes
He's the father of your two daughters.
00:02:42 Janice Knight
Yes, Mike and I got married in 1979 and he unfortunately was killed December of 1992 on his way home from work.
00:02:53 Janice Knight
He was killed by a drunk driver which left me to raise two children ages nine and five at the time.
00:02:59 Janice Knight
And it's been a long struggle raising two kids by yourself and dealing with their feelings of drunk drivers and things like that.
00:03:11 Lisa Hayes
I can't imagine that must have been just terrible.
00:03:16 Lisa Hayes
So, well, let's talk about your...
00:03:20 Lisa Hayes
I know you went to public schools in James Island, and you graduated from Fort Johnson High School in 1975?
00:03:27 Lisa Hayes
The year I was born.
00:03:29 Janice Knight
Thank you.
00:03:33 Lisa Hayes
And so I see here that you have been associated with the Library Society since 1976.
00:03:41 Lisa Hayes
So tell us how you first came to know about the Library Society.
00:03:45 Lisa Haye
Well, first I know you've told me before your grandmother used to live downtown, so when you were growing up here in Charleston, did you know about the Library Society before your work?
00:03:53 Janice Knight
No, had never heard of the Library Society.
00:03:57 Janice Knight
When I was a senior in high school different people actually were working here that I knew through high school.
00:04:06 Janice Knight
And then my friend, Terry was able to get me a job and at that point we were both going to tech and so while we were going to school is when we started, we were considered the student assistants and so we worked mostly afternoons after we got out of school.
00:04:23 Lisa Hayes
And what did you do?
00:04:25 Janice Knight
As a student assistant, we worked the desk, checking in books, checking out books.
00:04:34 Janice Knight
There were cards that were typed.
00:04:36 Janice Knight
It was up to us to file them in the card catalog process books by tape, by gluing in the card in pocket and the date due slips. And at that time we actually shellacked books to keep bugs from eating the covers.
00:04:52 Janice Knight
So there was an area downstairs that we would go and we’d lay out newspaper and we would shellac the books.
00:05:00 Janice Knight
So, but I worked as a student assistant until...
00:05:06 Janice Knight
Well, Let’s see.
00:05:07 Janice Knight
I guess I left that time in 1978.
00:05:14 Janice Knight
And at that point I went and worked at Swygert shipyard over on Johns Island. I did payroll work over there and after about 2 1/2 years there I did leave and I came downtown and worked at Kerrison’s department store. I was only there about six months.
00:05:33 Janice Knight
And then I had the opportunity to come back to the Library Society.
00:05:37 Janice Knight
And that's what I chose to do, and it's been home ever since.
00:05:41 Lisa Hayes
And what year was that?
00:05:43 Janice Knight
I came back in 1981, February of ‘81, so I have been here full time since February of ‘81.
00:05:51 Lisa Hayes
And that's 43 years.
00:05:53 Janice Knight
43, almost 44 years.
00:05:55 Lisa Hayes
Almost 44 years.
00:05:57 Lisa Hayes
It's really incredible, probably.
00:05:59 Lisa Hayes
The longest association of anybody in the library’s history.
00:06:01 Lisa Hayes
That's my guess I don't know.
00:06:03 Janice Knight
But I think Miss Fitzsimmons was actually here 50 years, but pretty much everyone else, you know, I told someone one time they called and asked about if we had openings.
00:06:14 Janice Knight
I told him no.
00:06:14 Janice Knight
We were like the Supreme Court.
00:06:16 Janice Knight
You either died or resigned.
00:06:18 Janice Knight
That was the only way to get us out of here.
00:06:20 Janice Knight
So since I haven't done either yet I'm still here.
00:06:23 Lisa Hayes
And we are so grateful.
00:06:25 Lisa Hayes
Don't want either of those things to happen but we know things happen.
00:06:31 Lisa Hayes
So now we know how long you've been here, and tell us about your job right now. What do you do in 2022 at the Library Society?
00:06:42 Janice Knight
I handle payroll.
00:06:44 Janice Knight
I handle accounts payable.
00:06:47 Janice Knight
Uhm, accounts receivable.
00:06:49 Janice Knight
'cause I do all the deposits and stuff so I'm watching and balancing 4 different accounts for the library.
00:06:59 Janice Knight
I help with programs sometimes, if needed.
00:07:04 Janice Knight
Uhm, just.
00:07:06 Janice Knight
A whole realm of things covering a general day and every day is different.
00:07:12 Lisa Hayes
Well, and you're very modest.
00:07:14 Lisa Hayes
You're like guard dog, mom, nurse.
00:07:22 Janice Knight
I wear a few hats.
00:07:23 Lisa Hayes
You do so much here at the Library Society and I know you probably have always been like that. I can't imagine what 25 year old Janice was like. I bet you were a lot like you are now.
00:07:36 Lisa Hayes
Am I right?
00:07:36 Janice Knight
I think in many ways.
00:07:38 Janice Knight
Yeah I was.
00:07:40 Janice Knight
I had a friend years ago who said I was way older than my age, so.
00:07:46 Janice Knight
I have been more like a Mama to everybody.
00:07:49 Janice Knight
Yeah, particularly kids in the neighborhood and then younger staff members.
00:07:53 Janice Knight
I just have always had a sense of taking care of or whatever.
00:08:00 Lisa Hayes
Yeah, you really do.
00:08:02 Lisa Hayes
I mean, when the children come in for story time, you're always wanting to, I know you want to hug them.
00:08:07 Lisa Hayes
I don't know if you actually hug him, but you smile and you light up when you see those kids come in and or when staff brings their children in.
00:08:15 Janice Knight
And yeah, kids are wonderful and to be bringing them in particularly now that we have such an incredible program with our story, time for the kids.
00:08:25 Janice Knight
It's so fun because these kids are just so excited when they come in and they will stop and glance up to see if I'm there.
00:08:34 Janice Knight
And so we say hi and we wave.
00:08:37 Janice Knight
But you're right, I don't try to hug many of them, that's kind of frowned upon in this day and age, but I would if I could.
00:08:48 Lisa Hayes
So you have seen a lot of changes.
00:08:50 Lisa Hayes
I want to talk first, maybe about some of like the building changes.
00:08:53 Lisa Hayes
So when you started, you mentioned you shellacked books in the basement.
00:08:58 Lisa Hayes
Can you tell us like what was the library sort of facility like and where was that basement?
00:09:05 Janice Knight
Well at that time the main building was the only building that we really used.
00:09:12 Janice Knight
We had purchased the Barnwell Annex in the mid ‘60s, but this building was considered more for storage.
00:09:21 Janice Knight
The, so we were downstairs on the 1st floor of the library and there was a big table in the middle of that space.
00:09:30 Janice Knight
And we would like, I say, cover it with newspaper and then literally painted shellac on the books, because that would, hopefully, at that point it was working to keep the roaches and other bugs from getting in or eating on the books.
00:09:47 Lisa Hayes
Those were the circulating books?
00:09:50 Janice Knight
Yes, and you'd have to leave them for a couple of days to make sure that they were dry and not real tacky feeling, so that would happen and then we’d bring them up.
00:09:58 Janice Knight
And of course we did the shelving. As student assistants we did the shelving.
00:10:01 Janice Knight
So we would put those out.
00:10:07 Janice Knight
But that was downstairs.
00:10:08 Lisa Hayes
Downstairs and where was your desk?
00:10:11 Lisa Hayes
Where did the librarians sit?
00:10:15 Janice Knight
At that time, the librarians’ desks were in the center of the back area near the steps going up to the balcony.
00:10:27 Janice Knight
As student assistants, we really didn't have a desk because we weren't expected to be sitting down.
00:10:35 Janice Knight
So we did not need to have a desk.
00:10:39 Janice Knight
As time went on in that same space, there were six desks in that area which included the head librarian and several other librarians in that space.
00:10:56 Janice Knight
Myself, I am not a librarian.
00:10:59 Janice Knight
My background is accounting, and that's what I do.
00:11:03 Janice Knight
But we were all in that area and in that space the one lady, one librarian, would be checking books or reading journals to choose books to be purchased.
00:11:17 Janice Knight
The catalog librarian.
00:11:19 Janice Knight
She would catalogue the books.
00:11:21 Janice Knight
I would type the cards in the pockets and whatever was necessary to make the book, to prepare the book to be put into circulation.
00:11:31 Janice Knight
And so the six desks were back there.
00:11:35 Janice Knight
And at that point the student assistants did have a desk, but we had at least three student assistants most of time, and so they rotated.
00:11:44 Janice Knight
You know 'cause they weren't all here at the same time, so but they did have a desk that they rotated and used.
00:11:51 Lisa Hayes
And did you work with the patrons coming in, like, how...
00:11:57 Lisa Hayes
I guess I'm trying to get an idea of where you had a lot of staff, it sounds like.
00:12:01 Lisa Hayes
But how busy was the library and did you help people find things?
00:12:04 Lisa Hayes
Or were you, since you were doing accounting where you..?
00:12:07 Janice Knight
Yes and yes.
00:12:09 Janice Knight
We did a lot.
00:12:10 Janice Knight
I was still doing, you know, the phone would ring you get the phone, someone would come to the desk, you work the desk.
00:12:17 Janice Knight
Usually it was kind of, first one to get up.
00:12:20 Janice Knight
Well, that was usually me.
00:12:22 Janice Knight
But whatever, so I would, you know, you'd work the desk.
00:12:26 Janice Knight
You would help people locate books, you would, you know, take the books in that they had brought back.
00:12:34 Janice Knight
Make sure that they realized if they had fines that needed to be paid, or if they had one book out still that they haven't checked under the car seat for.
00:12:44 Janice Knight
Or whatever in order to get things in order.
00:12:47 Janice Knight
And then of course by the end of the day, then those books would have been shelved.
00:12:52 Janice Knight
Uh huh, they were returned.
00:12:53 Lisa Hayes
Did the special collections what we call the special collections? The archives?
00:12:58 Lisa Hayes
Did that collection get used very much in that time, like where people coming in to look at the old stuff then?
00:13:04 Janice Knight
At that time we used a lot of things in what we call the lock section and a lot of those, well, those books have been transferred into what is now special collections.
00:13:16 Janice Knight
And they were in an area that we would frequently use.
00:13:20 Janice Knight
That was why we kept them on the main floor.
00:13:24 Janice Knight
People used books at that time.
00:13:27 Janice Knight
You didn't have the computer, you didn't rely on that type of electronic source.
00:13:33 Janice Knight
It wasn't available at that time, so when they would come in, we had books in the lock section that were kind of our immediate go to and people did a lot more genealogy work at that time and they would literally sit down with the books and trace certain people in the histories or plantations and the histories and different things.
00:13:57 Janice Knight
But they did it by reading the books.
00:14:01 Janice Knight
It wasn't just plug it into a computer and wait for it to give you the answer. It took a long time to do what today doesn't take nearly that long.
00:14:10 Janice Knight
Oh sure, yeah, and you know they we would need to know like a time period or were they actually here?
00:14:17 Janice Knight
Did they really come into Charleston or did they actually come into the United States from New York?
00:14:22 Janice Knight
Well, then we wouldn't necessarily have the records that they needed.
00:14:26 Janice Knight
There were times we would also refer them possibly to the Historical Society or to the Public Library if we thought that they might have just a little bit different records than what we actually had, and the three of us, the three organizations, worked well together, because although we all had a lot of the same things, everyone had a little something that somebody else didn't.
00:14:52 Janice Knight
And so it was easy to refer people you know, OK, you didn't find anything here, but you still need to check the Historical Society or the main library and see if possibly they have other records so.
00:15:07 Lisa Hayes
Well, and so I kind of we kind of know what you did in a day.
00:15:11 Lisa Hayes
Am I right?
00:15:12 Lisa Hayes
Like is there anything else you want to add to what kinds of things you were working on at that or it doesn't have to just be early days, but is there anything else you'd like to tell us about your duties here?
00:15:26 Janice Knight
There are certain things that are done primarily day-to-day, and then there are always other things that come up and setting priorities as to how those extra things get done or when they get done is a big part of my day.
00:15:43 Lisa Hayes
Yeah, yeah.
00:15:45 Lisa Hayes
Well, so tell us who hired you.
00:15:48 Lisa Hayes
Well, we could talk a little bit about staff now that you've seen a lot of staff come and go.
00:15:54 Lisa Hayes
Who did you interview with?
00:15:55 Lisa Hayes
If you remember that.
00:15:57 Janice Knight
Well, when I first came in 1976, Virginia Rugheimer, who was the head librarian at the time, she hired me at that point. When I came back in 1981, Catherine Sadler, who was the head librarian at that time, she was the one who hired me at that point. And then, of course, I've worked with Cathy for many, many years. And then Eric Emerson for 2 1/2 years. And Anne Cleveland now for 14 years.
00:16:31 Lisa Hayes
Or some years wow.
00:16:35 Lisa Hayes
So you, you've been here since Anne has been here and I know you've seen a lot of change since Anne has been here,. Has has her tenure have been the one where you've seen the biggest changes or what can you tell us about some of the other big changes that you've seen?
00:16:54 Janice Knight
Definitely working with Anne has been the biggest changes, not just to the facility itself but how things have been done. Changing up the way the collection is handled is a big change that has happened in the time that Anne has been here.
00:17:10 Janice Knight
Not necessarily that Anne has done it, but she has brought in a fabulous team of people who have changed the way that things are processed and handled and it's making, it has made a huge difference to the Library Society.
00:17:29 Janice Knight
To the collection to the institution that we are.
00:17:38 Lisa Hayes
Yeah, I feel really lucky to be here in, during her tenure, which is about to end. But I do think I mean, what, can you tell us some about what things were like maybe in the 1980s and 90s as far as projects that the staff was working on? I know that's kind of the era when, well, we didn't get our online catalog until 2013, but what are some of the other technological changes, maybe that happened before that?
00:18:07 Janice Knight
Well, the first computer we had in here, the monitor itself was about the size of a console TV back in the ‘70s. It was huge and I am not a fan of technology.
00:18:21 Janice Knight
I still like a piece of paper and a pencil. I'm just fine. But when we first started using the computer.
00:18:29 Lisa Hayes
Where was that computer stored?
00:18:31 Janice Knight
Actually, that computer was in this room that we're sitting in right now (the Fellows Room).
00:18:39 Janice Knight
It was against the wall right over here, which would be the south wall of the conference room, and it was a big piece and I was always scared to death of it.
00:18:50 Janice Knight
So I would tell Cathy that all I knew was BRB.
00:18:56 Janice Knight
Big red button. It turns it on, turns it off.
00:18:58 Janice Knight
I don't know a thing.
00:18:59 Janice Knight
I don't know anything else about
00:19:00 Lisa Hayes
What was it used for?
00:19:02 Janice Knight
Actually she, we would keep up with the checks as we paid bills.
00:19:07 Janice Knight
We could do that on the computer.
00:19:10 Janice Knight
We also did a lot of the membership things, were finally getting put on to the computer at that point.
00:19:20 Janice Knight
But we still, but at that time we did not use the computer as part of our desk like we do now.
00:19:27 Janice Knight
At the main desk you have a circulation person there and everything is done through the computer.
00:19:36 Janice Knight
We were still very much old school and everything was done paper and pencil.
00:19:43 Janice Knight
Even right down to the markings of the date due for the when the book should be returned.
00:19:51 Janice Knight
There were so many chores and stuff that we did every day that seemed kind of silly now, but it was what ran the library at the time to know the number of fiction or nonfiction that went out or when we first started collecting DVDs, which was a huge thing at that point and, you know, learning how to or choosing a way to record them so that you could find out if we actually had that title in our collection of DVD movies.
00:20:27 Janice Knight
But the memberships which I worked on, they were all done by hand and there were like 5 different places that I had written out a person name and address.
00:20:38 Janice Knight
So by the time I finished I pretty much had it memorized.
00:20:42 Janice Knight
They were, there was a time when I knew who was in the library by the cars that were in the parking lot.
00:20:49 Janice Knight
Just one of those silly things.
00:20:50 Lisa Hayes
Well, and I've been here when someone has come in, he's been a member for maybe a long time, but you haven't seen them in a long time, but you will recognize them, know their name, and know their address and their member number I think.
00:21:01 Janice Knight
I have won many. But it's just one of those certain people make certain images, you know, or they do something that makes you remember, yeah, whether it's something quirky.
00:21:17 Janice Knight
Whether it's something very sweet, whether it's just the way they talk to you or talk with you.
00:21:24 Janice Knight
Do they talk at you or talk with you and there's a difference.
00:21:28 Janice Knight
So it just depends upon how I have perceived that person as to how easy it was to remember a name. Or not.
00:21:41 Lisa Hayes
Well, so you talk about this giant computer. Was that around, I'm afraid to ask, but was that like 1985?
00:21:48 Lisa Hayes
Or was that like 1997 when we got that computer?
00:21:51 Janice Knight
No, it would have been in the 80s. And actually it might have been early 80s at that point, it could have actually been early 80s.
00:21:59 Lisa Hayes
OK.
0:22:03 Janice Knight
But like I say it was, it was still.
00:22:06 Janice Knight
It was such a dinosaur, but it was top of the line at that time.
00:22:13 Lisa Hayes
Was it hard to get funding for things like that?
00:22:16 Lisa Hayes
Was the board at that time supportive of advances that the library wanted to make?
00:22:22 Janice Knight
Yeah, now some of it might have taken a little more arm twisting than other things, but knowing how it was going to be used and who would be used, it wasn't like we were putting it out on a table for anyone to just walk by and play with or something.
00:22:38 Janice Knight
So the fact that it was being used by staff only and it was in a room that no one else would have been going to anyway.
00:22:48 Janice Knight
It wasn't hard to get permission to get into the technological age, so.
00:22:55 Lisa Hayes
OK, so in 2013 is when we got the online catalog. Was that process pretty smooth? I mean I'm jumping ahead a lot of years, but like up until from say 1985 to 2013 when someone wanted to check a book out, would they look at the, they would look at the card file to find the card and then what what would that process be after that?
00:23:20 Janice Knight
If they were coming to the desk to check out a book, we would pull out the card from the pocket. Where if it was a buff colored card, it was a nonfiction and you knew that because it would have two sets of numbers on it before you had the authors name and the title of a book.
00:23:38 Janice Knight
That's how you knew that it was a non fiction.
00:23:41 Janice Knight
For a novel or for, excuse me or for, or a mystery.
00:23:46 Janice Knight
It was on what we call like a salmon colored card, so you knew that it was different.
00:23:53 Janice Knight
So you would pull the card out and we take the date due stamp, and we'd stamp that. We'd stamp the date due slip in the front of the book and we would tell them, OK, your book is due 2 weeks from now.
00:24:05 Janice Knight
The 12th or whatever it might have been. And then those cards we would stamp with the same date due.
00:24:13 Janice Knight
And every membership has a number.
00:24:16 Janice Knight
That number was then written on the next line, so if Barbara Doyle had come in to take out something for herself, I know that we would stamp those and the number was 346.
00:24:31 Janice Knight
That was her number.
00:24:32 Janice Knight
I could look at cards, a lot of cards, and pretty much tell you who had had the book based on the fact that I had known whose number was what.
00:24:41 Lisa Hayes
Well, and did you do that for privacy so that the person who got the book next wouldn't know who just had it, or no?
00:24:47 Janice Knight
It really wasn't that at the time, it was just the way it was done.
00:24:54 Janice Knight
At that point I don't think we were worried nearly as much as, or as cautious at that time as what we try to be now that you can't tell that you know Jane Smith had that book last.
00:25:07 Janice Knight
It doesn't refer to anything unless you happen to know that person well enough and know what their card number is.
00:25:15 Janice Knight
Otherwise it would just have someone else's number on it.
00:25:19 Janice Knight
And when the book was returned, you would look through the date due stamp. If it told you it was due on the 12th you would go to the cards because they had been put behind that date in these little trays that we used at the desk. You'd look behind that number and you would match up the card to what the pocket said in the front of the book and you put it back and then that was how it was checked in.
00:25:48 Janice Knight
Whereas now we slide it under the digital beep and it's checked back in.
00:25:54 Lisa Hayes
So did you have much problem with people stealing books or not returning books?
00:26:00 Janice Knight
I think the biggest problem we got into was college students.
00:26:06 Janice Knight
Because they would need the books for research papers or, and then they never seemed to find time to bring them back.
00:26:15 Janice Knight
Now there was a time that the college used to help us by withholding the students grades until they squared up with the library, which meant that they had to bring back our books. And I don't know if they all paid fines, but at least we got our books back, which was the most important part.
00:26:35 Janice Knight
Ah, but there were many times that we've just never gotten the books back.
00:26:41 Janice Knight
But when someone would come in and go, I have been looking everywhere for this.
00:26:46 Janice Knight
My radar went off and said, I'm sorry, you know, as a new member I can't let you check that out right now.
00:26:52 Janice Knight
Your name actually has to go before the board of trustees.
00:26:56 Janice Knight
And they don't meet again until and whatever their next date might have been, because nine chances out of ten, that book would have not come back to the house.
00:27:07 Lisa Hayes
They would have joined and just taken that book and then not brought it back 'cause they had been looking everywhere for that. Now if they hadn't said that, I would not have had my radar out to catch that, but because he did, it alerted me that I'm not sure if I trust this.
00:27:25 Janice Knight
If they've been looking that hard, then maybe this is the time to just throw out the story that the board has to approve the memberships.
00:27:36 Lisa Hayes
Before they can join.
00:27:38 Lisa Hayes
So I'm talking a little bit about theft of books.
00:27:41 Lisa Hayes
I know there's a story about our Audubon elephant folios.
00:27:46 Lisa Hayes
Do you want to share with us what you know about that?
00:27:50 Janice Knight
Well, we went looking to do the annual inventory to make sure that everything was in good shape and accounted for.
00:28:01 Janice Knight
And the storage area that they were supposed to be in was empty.
00:28:05 Janice Knight
Apparently someone had managed to get them out of the building.
00:28:10 Janice Knight
The only thing we could figure is that at the time they must have hid in the library until after we had left.
00:28:21 Janice Knight
And at that point they simply opened the back door and walked right out with them.
00:28:28 Janice Knight
Luckily, through just minor chit chat and things that we remembered, we kind of came up with an idea as to who might have taken it.
00:28:38 Janice Knight
And so, of course it was all discussed with the police and then they had to get your story and make sure that.
00:28:46 Janice Knight
Anyway, long story short, they did find them.
00:28:49 Janice Knight
They were returned.
00:28:50 Janice Knight
At that point, they were put in crates and put in a bank vault.
00:28:56 Janice Knight
But of course, the purpose of the Audubons was never just to put them in a bank vault. These were just amazing prints.
00:29:06 Janice Knight
In essence, they finally decided there was, I believe, there was an individual.
00:29:11 Janice Knight
It might not have been, but I think it was an individual who wanted to purchase the whole collection.
00:29:19 Janice Knight
And the board of Trustees, after talking it through and trying to figure out, you know, if it was worth doing, if it was the best choice for the Audubons.
00:29:34 Janice Knight
And I believe was around 1984 that they chose, yes, it was. It was a smart choice for the library financially, but also for the Audubons to be sold because this person was also going to be able to preserve and restore some of the things that might have had some issues.
00:29:57 Lisa Hayes
Uh huh, well so and we're so lucky now that we have the new building, the newest building with the two vaults in it. Can you tell us about how that purchase?
00:30:09 Lisa Hayes
I think it was in 1995.
00:30:10 Janice Knight
Actually, we purchased the property, which is the Ripley Ravenel building now.
00:30:17 Janice Knight
In early 90s and in 1995, that building was built.
00:30:23 Janice Knight
And then that includes the Executive Director's Office, librarians’ offices, workspace. At that time we also had, moved the children’s room from the main, to the upper level of the Ripley Ravenel building, but that has been changed over the years.
00:30:46 Janice Knight
The configuration of the space is totally different from the way it was built initially, but having the two vaults in the Ripley Ravenel building is an amazing protection for our rare books, manuscripts, maps, special collections.
00:31:11 Lisa Hayes
And the, and now we have Buxton books in the front part of the Ripley Ravenel downstairs. What was that space thought to be?
00:31:21 Lisa Hayes
What was the purpose of that initially?
00:31:24 Janice Knight
Initially, I think they had planned that the librarians would use that space downstairs.
00:31:32 Janice Knight
They had, it was all set up with computer access and telephone access, etc., which would have put them on the level with the main vault.
00:31:48 Janice Knight
They really decided that maybe that was not the best use and they started to use it as it was used several times for book sales. But then it was turned into some retail space and the first person that was down there was a young woman who had an art gallery and it went OK for a couple of years and then she wasn't doing it. She, her business was not doing very well, and so she had to leave. And then we had another person that went in, and he had an antique store, and he was in there for numerous years and then when he left because he was ill, he was closing down his business. And then luckily enough through Anne we now have Buxton Books downstairs, which is a wonderful collaboration.
00:32:43 Lisa Hayes
And we also, so we're in the middle building. The annex building.
00:32:48 Lisa Hayes
What can you tell us?
00:32:48 Lisa Hayes
So we have the bindery here now below us.
00:32:52 Lisa Hayes
Tell us about how the bindery came to be.
00:32:55 Janice Knight
That is another Anne project. She thought that the library needed a space like that where you could make repairs and different things.
00:33:07 Janice Knight
She was lucky enough to find Brien Biedler at first.
00:33:12 Janice Knight
And when the area was, you know, created basically because it had been used for so many years for storage.
00:33:21 Janice Knight
So when it was all cleaned up and made into the bindery that it is now, he was the first bookbinder for the Library Society.
00:33:32 Janice Knight
And it turned out to just be, you know, a perfect combination.
00:33:37 Lisa Hayes
Yeah, and the equipment that's in there.
00:33:39 Lisa Hayes
Do you remember how that came to be here at the library?
00:33:43 Janice Knight
Different things.
00:33:44 Janice Knight
Different people have donated things that they had personally, or they were closing down different areas.
00:33:52 Janice Knight
And James, who is now the bookbinder.
00:33:55 Janice Knight
James Davis.
00:33:58 Janice Knight
But different pieces have come to us through different means.
00:34:04 Lisa Hayes
Well, and I want to know during Hurricane Hugo or any other big sort of natural disasters or big events here in Charleston. Sort of what was, what were you doing and how did the library fare?
00:34:19 Lisa Hayes
So maybe we could start with Hurricane Hugo, or if there's something else that's earlier that you want to tell us about.
00:34:24 Janice Knight
Well Hugo, in 89. We were very fortunate. We had, Cathy and I, 'cause I came in with her ahead of time, and there were areas along the 1st floor of the main building that things were not on the floor, but only a few inches off the floor.
00:34:47 Janice Knight
And so we took them and put them on tables and covered them so that they, if we had gotten any water coming in, these items were not going to be threatened with the water.
00:35:00 Janice Knight
They were on a higher surface.
00:35:01 Janice Knight
So we did that through a couple of areas and we were very fortunate.
00:35:08 Janice Knight
The area above the nonfiction on the balcony end, up towards where there is an opening that goes to the roof, apparently the opening blew open.
00:35:23 Janice Knight
We lost maybe 10 or 12 books up there, which was phenomenal considering what it could have been.
00:35:30 Janice Knight
Yeah, so that was basically all the damage that we had.
00:35:37 Lisa Hayes
Did you have any damage at your house or no?
00:35:39 Janice Knight
We were fortunate.
00:35:42 Janice Knight
There were, we had plenty of pine trees in the backyard that do not exist now.
00:35:46 Janice Knight
The pecan tree was beautiful, but it no longer exists.
00:35:49 Janice Knight
I took out all the trees but by grace of God my house was not hurt.
00:35:54 Janice Knight
Needed the roof, but that was not a big deal because it, it probably would have needed it in a short time anyway.
00:36:03 Janice Knight
But we were lucky in many fashions, in many, many ways that we did not have personal loss.
00:36:12 Janice Knight
Now Cathy lived downtown and she ended up with four and a half feet of water in her home.
00:36:19 Janice Knight
So she had tremendous loss of her personal items and collections.
00:36:26 Lisa Hayes
Did she come to the library that day to stay safe or was she at her house?
00:36:30 Janice Knight
When it happened, she was not at her house when it happened, but actually she and her family that were in the back half of her house, they came and stayed at the library for several days because of the water and the conditions and what have you.
00:36:47 Janice Knight
They were able to stay here that was high and dry.
00:36:54 Janice Knight
That also allowed her to watch the collection and make sure that what I said was the only problems we had was truly the only problems that we had.
00:37:05 Janice Knight
We were lucky.
00:37:06 Lisa Hayes
Well, and I would think we didn't have a security system then and if power was out, you know, might think about people breaking in to maybe steal things, I don't know.
00:37:15 Janice Knight
Well we weren't as concerned, I think, about anyone breaking in.
00:37:20 Janice Knight
It was really more whether or not we would get water on the peninsula, but luckily for the Library Society, it's on pretty much the highest point of the peninsula that is truly the peninsula and not filled in land, which a lot of Charleston peninsula is.
00:37:40 Janice Knight
So we were not in a danger zone per se for flooding.
00:37:46 Lisa Hayes
So well, and so how many times would you guess that you've had to, I don't know, board up the windows here at the library? Or do any kind of hurricane prep over the last few years.
00:37:58 Janice Knight
Numerous numerous times that we have gone back and move things out of harm's way.
00:38:06 Janice Knight
You know, worrying about if something could come through a window or, you know, were we locked securely, you know, so there have been numerous times that we've had to get our game plan together and get things prepared.
00:38:23 Lisa Hayes
And was Hugo really the only sort of incident that even something did happen?
00:38:30 Janice Knight
Yeah, other times it was really rain, but not necessarily anything that damaged or caused any concern to the Library Society.
00:38:43 Janice Knight
So like I said, we we're pretty fortunate to be where we are downtown.
00:38:50 Lisa Hayes
Well, so do you want to talk some about some cultural things and us?
00:38:54 Lisa Hayes
Spoleto is a big thing in here in Charleston, and the Charleston literary festival.
00:39:00 Lisa Hayes
Are there other kind of big things that you can think of that has been a, I don't know, like a touchstone here at the Library Society?
00:39:10 Janice Knight
Well Spoleto used to do several of their events here.
00:39:14 Janice Knight
Martha Teichner used to come and do her “Talks with Martha Teichner” here and she's a delightful person and she actually has a membership too.
00:39:27 Janice Knight
But she would come in and she was interviewing people who were part of other events. They were here to do.
00:39:36 Janice Knight
Maybe they were with dance or music or opera or something.
00:39:43 Janice Knight
And so she was taking that time to introduce these people that made the ticket much more appealing, I think because you got to hear the person. You got to know the person in that time instead of maybe sitting and watching a play or watching or listening to an opera or something. You had actually had the chance to hear this person speak, and she did that for numerous years.
00:40:10 Janice Knight
The literary festival was, used to be Charleston to Charleston when it was first founded here, and we had, of course, a lot of the programs were done right here.
00:40:23 Janice Knight
Then we grew to the point that we had to go over to the Dock Street Theater.
00:40:30 Janice Knight
And things have changed over the years and they are a separate entity now. They are not part of us here at the Library Society. But they seem to have a lot going for them, and the festival seems to be rolling along very well.
00:40:47 Lisa Hayes
Well, and I know from working here, I know that some of your favorite programs seem to be the music programs is that right?
00:40:54 Janice Knight
I do enjoy the music programs. I love to have the CSO come in, or chamber music Charleston.
00:41:02 Janice Knight
I'm just fascinated with the talent of these folks.
00:41:07 Janice Knight
I have absolutely no talent whatsoever.
00:41:10 Janice Knight
And it just makes it that much more amazing to me that they are so talented.
00:41:21 Janice Knight
And the music is just beautiful.
00:41:23 Janice Knight
It doesn't matter if you're really into opera or classical or, I love Laura Ball and the things that she brings in. So it's everything from Beatles Bach and beer to you know, opera.
00:41:39 Janice Knight
But it's still, it's just amazing that all the talent, yeah, that these people have.
00:41:45 Lisa Hayes
What people are capable of with a lot of practice, yeah.
00:41:58 Lisa Hayes
Well, I don't know. Janice, is there anything else that I have not asked you about that you feel like people would like to know about anything at all?
00:42:09 Janice Knight
I think we've done a pretty good job of covering things.
00:42:13 Janice Knight
I still, every day is a new day in many ways.
00:42:22 Janice Knight
Not just, it's a new day.
00:42:25 Janice Knight
Coming in every day is different.
00:42:28 Janice Knight
You don't necessarily see the same people every day.
00:42:31 Janice Knight
You don't necessarily work with the same people every day, so every day is different.
00:42:38 Janice Knight
You meet someone new.
00:42:40 Janice Knight
You learn something new.
00:42:43 Janice Knight
So it's just an amazing place to be.
00:42:48 Lisa Hayes
Thank you, thank you.
Citation
Knight, Janice, “Janice Knight (interviewed by Lisa Hayes on November 9, 2022),” Charleston Library Society Digital Collections, accessed September 9, 2024, https://charlestonlibrarysociety.omeka.net/items/show/1299.